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Can either YHWH or Allah lie? And why?
08-10-2017, 05:19 PM
Post: #1
Question Can either YHWH or Allah lie? And why?
Can either YHWH or Allah lie?
Based on which premises?[/font][/size]
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08-10-2017, 07:25 PM (This post was last modified: 08-10-2017 09:08 PM by susanblange.)
Post: #2
RE: Can either YHWH or Allah lie? And why?
Everybody lies, Hannah. Psalm 116:11. "I said in my haste, All men are liars". But there is a difference between lying and false witness. False witness is always a lie, but a lie isn't always false witness. God has never and will never commit false witness. Numbers 23:19. "God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent..." False witness and swearing falsely by the name of God is one of the seven deadly sins.
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08-10-2017, 08:09 PM
Post: #3
RE: Can either YHWH or Allah lie? And why?
(08-10-2017 07:25 PM)susanblange Wrote:  False witness is always a lie, but a lie isn't always false witness.

Please try to explain this logical conflagration.

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08-10-2017, 08:18 PM
Post: #4
RE: Can either YHWH or Allah lie? And why?
It makes perfect sense... Giving a false story of your own experience is always lying. But not all lies are stories of your experience.

Just like how all cats are animals but not all animals are cats.
The rest of it is nonsense of course.

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08-10-2017, 09:12 PM (This post was last modified: 08-10-2017 10:25 PM by susanblange.)
Post: #5
RE: Can either YHWH or Allah lie? And why?
(08-10-2017 08:09 PM)Satyros Wrote:  
(08-10-2017 07:25 PM)susanblange Wrote:  False witness is always a lie, but a lie isn't always false witness.

Please try to explain this logical conflagration.

You can commit false witness by sight or hearing. This includes falsely stating what you have seen or not seen, and falsely stating what you have heard or not heard. That's the best I can explain it. Perjury, or swearing falsely by the name of God to tell the truth, like in a courtroom, is also a deadly sin. We are also not supposed to lie to each other, and in a future perfect world, we won't have to.
(08-10-2017 08:18 PM)PeterPants Wrote:  It makes perfect sense... Giving a false story of your own experience is always lying. But not all lies are stories of your experience.

Just like how all cats are animals but not all animals are cats.
The rest of it is nonsense of course.

I think you're projecting, Peter. But you're a lost cause anyway so there's no hope for you. You're an atheist and a fool. If you're calling me a liar, you're walking down the path to perdition.
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08-10-2017, 10:03 PM
Post: #6
RE: Can either YHWH or Allah lie? And why?
Well, someone overreacted to Peter explaining your statement better than you did...

So tell us, susan; why do you think your god will not lie, aside from a passage in a book that points out the obvious state of not being mortal?

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08-10-2017, 10:13 PM (This post was last modified: 08-10-2017 10:16 PM by PeterPants.)
Post: #7
RE: Can either YHWH or Allah lie? And why?
Susan... I was literally defending you. Real nice of you to tell me im a lost cause and a fool. Is that how you always react to people trying to back you up?
@satyros I think she was actually saying that god CAN lie, and that's fine, but he cannot give a particular kind of lie, that being false witness.

I'm loosing the sense that there is a difference now though...Can anyone think of a lie that is not giving false witness?

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08-10-2017, 10:48 PM
Post: #8
RE: Can either YHWH or Allah lie? And why?
(08-10-2017 10:13 PM)PeterPants Wrote:  I'm loosing the sense that there is a difference now though...Can anyone think of a lie that is not giving false witness?

I don't think so. In the end, it's going to come down to what you've seen/heard/did, etc.

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08-10-2017, 11:05 PM (This post was last modified: 08-10-2017 11:06 PM by The_Squid.)
Post: #9
RE: Can either YHWH or Allah lie? And why?
Didn't God lie to Abraham about killing his son? "Kill your son for me... no, no! Just kidding!"

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08-10-2017, 11:08 PM (This post was last modified: 08-10-2017 11:09 PM by PeterPants.)
Post: #10
RE: Can either YHWH or Allah lie? And why?
Hmmmm.

If I lie and say 'im three hundred years old' then I'm falsely stating what I've witnessed.
If I lie and say 'im hate Candy's again, it's still a false witnessing...

Yeah, Susan I don't think a lie that is not a false witnessing exists.. if this is so, then I guess your position is simply that God does not lie?

If it's not so, I'd love an example of a lie that can't be considered giving false witness.
(08-10-2017 11:05 PM)The_Squid Wrote:  Didn't God lie to Abraham about killing his son? "Kill your son for me... no, no! Just kidding!"

Oh, that's an interesting example.. wheres The lie though? Asking someone to do something you don't really want them to do, does not actually seem like a lie to me.. it's something else entirely Tongue no?

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