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Could Muhammad have been a prophet
01-12-2010, 02:10 PM
Post: #1
Could Muhammad have been a prophet
Do you think Muhammad could have been a prophet, like the Jewish prophets, Moses, Aaron, David, Solomon, Ezra or Jeremiah?

Karen Armstrong said in the first of the two biographies that she wrote about the Prophet Muhammad:

"If we could view Muhammad as we do any other important historical figure we would surely consider him to be one of the greatest geniuses the world has known."

How do we know if some one is a true prophet or a false one?
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01-12-2010, 02:30 PM (This post was last modified: 01-12-2010 02:31 PM by Zagreus.)
Post: #2
RE: Could Muhammad have been a prophet
Well, we're into a tricky thing here, as people like Moses aren't definitely historical figures, but Muhammad was.

I would call him a prophet, in that I class him in with other people of that description, but I personally don't believe God communicated through him. (I'm an atheist)

I can't really answer your question due to my own personal beliefs on religion, but I think you ask an intersting question.

Also, slightly off topic, do you mean the Karen Armstrong that wrote a biography on Buddha? If so, I didn't even finish that book, as I really felt it was written with a Christian bias in a 'pop' style language, and was just almost a flight of fancy. Are the ones on Muhammad better?
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01-12-2010, 02:39 PM
Post: #3
RE: Could Muhammad have been a prophet
The original is generally better than the sequel.

Her first book, Muhammad: A Biography of the Prophet (Paperback) was written with materials that she believed in. The second may have been more of a commercial enterprise, I think.

I have not read Buddha, but I have read her own biography and 'Jerusalem.'
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01-12-2010, 03:10 PM
Post: #4
RE: Could Muhammad have been a prophet
I'll have a look at the first one then. It's going to be a try before buy though, as the one on Buddha was really disapointing.

Also, you're new, so welcome to the forum!
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01-12-2010, 04:46 PM (This post was last modified: 01-12-2010 04:50 PM by Stereophonic.)
Post: #5
RE: Could Muhammad have been a prophet
(01-12-2010 02:10 PM)Ahmadi Wrote:  Do you think Muhammad could have been a prophet, like the Jewish prophets, Moses, Aaron, David, Solomon, Ezra or Jeremiah?

Moral and theological issues aside, Mohammed came too late to be considered by Christians as a prophet. Once the very Word of God came to earth in human form, the need for additional prophets (in the sense that Muslims want to use that term for Mohammed) is obviated.

Christians can no more consider Mohammed a prophet than Muslims could ever consider adding additional (subsequent) writings to the Qur'an.

http://www.biblicaltraining.org/ --- http://www.ntwrightpage.com/
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01-12-2010, 05:25 PM
Post: #6
RE: Could Muhammad have been a prophet
See, I belong to Ahmadiyya Muslim Community, we believe that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad came as a reformer and a non-law bringing prophet, in Islam, like David and Solomon would be in the tradition of Moses. We also believe that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad was the second coming of Messiah. Now the Sunni and Shiites also believe in second coming yet insist that prophethood has ended. All Muslims believe that there have been 124,000 prophets before, but the Sunnis and Shiites want to draw a very sharp line now, that they cannot allow any further prophet according to Islam. Their belief may seem contradictory to me and you, as they do believe in the second coming, but they are adamant on this.

Despite need for a prophet, similar to the need in the past, it always seems in religious groups that their prophet is the last one, no more. Not on my watch! No way! Do you see any parallels here?
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01-12-2010, 05:37 PM
Post: #7
RE: Could Muhammad have been a prophet
(01-12-2010 05:25 PM)Ahmadi Wrote:  ...it always seems in religious groups that their prophet is the last one, no more...Do you see any parallels here?

Christians believe that Jesus is not merely another prophet. If Jesus had been merely a prophet, then my argument would not work and you would have a point--but if Jesus really is God in human flesh, as Christians claim, then any analogy between him and merely human prophets breaks down altogether.

Do you believe that more material can/will be added to the Qur'an?

http://www.biblicaltraining.org/ --- http://www.ntwrightpage.com/
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01-12-2010, 06:01 PM (This post was last modified: 01-12-2010 06:39 PM by Ahmadi.)
Post: #8
RE: Could Muhammad have been a prophet
That is a fair answer, if Jesus is god then all bets are off.

Now the Qur'an is a very dynamic book. And thank you for spelling it with a 'Q' rather than a 'K.' No text will be added to it, but infinite amount of meaning will be added to it, by the masters over time. It says, "And if all the trees that are in the earth were pens, and the ocean were ink, with seven oceans swelling it thereafter, the words of Allah would not be exhausted. Surely, Allah is Mighty, Wise." (Al Quran 31:28) It may seem a tall claim and I agree that it is very hard almost impossible for the novice to experience this dynamism, but masters do!

The main evidence that I want to suggest for now is a quote by German philosopher, Johann Wolfgang von Goethe. He said, "As often as we approach the Quran, it always proves repulsive anew; gradually, however, it attracts, it astonishes, and, in the end forces admiration."

Let me quote from Sir Zafrulla Khan, who served as president of the UN General Assembly in 1962–63; returning to the International Court of Justice in 1964, he served as the court's president from 1970 to 1973:

"The world is dynamic and so is the Quran. Indeed, so dynamic is the Quran that it has always been found to keep ahead of the world and never to lag behind it. However fast the pace at which the pattern of human life may change and progress, the Quran always yields, and will go on yielding, the needed guidance in advance. This has now been demonstrated through more than thirteen centuries, and that is a guarantee that it will continue to be demonstrated through the ages.
The Quran has proclaimed that falsehood will never overtake it. All research into the past and every discovery and invention in the future will affirm its truth (41:43). The Quran speaks at every level; it seeks to reach every type of understanding, through parables, similitudes, arguments, reasoning, the observation and study of the phenomena of nature, and the natural, moral, and spiritual laws (18:55; 39:28; 29:22)."

(Goethe's quote is mentioned in several books. For example: RVC Bodley. The Messenger. Double Day and Company Inc, 1946. Page 237. And: John Davenport. An apology for Mohammed and the Koran, Published in 1869. Page 67. The book is available on archive.org)
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01-12-2010, 06:11 PM
Post: #9
RE: Could Muhammad have been a prophet
(01-12-2010 06:01 PM)Ahmadi Wrote:  That is a fair answer, if Jesus is god then all bets are off.

And if Jesus is God in human flesh, then the Qur'an speaks falsely about God.


(01-12-2010 06:01 PM)Ahmadi Wrote:  Now the Qur'an is a very dynamic book...infinite amount of meaning will be added to it, by the masters over time. It says, "And if all the trees that are in the earth were pens, and the ocean were ink, with seven oceans swelling it thereafter, the words of Allah would not be exhausted...

I think most Christians would understand these sentiments; we feel much the same about the Bible.

http://www.biblicaltraining.org/ --- http://www.ntwrightpage.com/
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01-12-2010, 07:11 PM
Post: #10
RE: Could Muhammad have been a prophet
Thank you so much, stereophonic for adequately dissecting out where we agree and where we may need to resolve our differences. I am also trying to keep this thread purely on one issue, if we can.

So, allow me to rephrase my original question. It is suggested that 16-20 % of population coming from Christian families is now unaffiliated in our USA and the numbers may be upto 40% in Europe. Yet I know that in their subconscious they carry the collective experience of the last 2000 years, of the society that they grew up in. So I want to know, how would I demonstrate to a Unitarian or a Jew or to one who is unaffiliated and no longer believes in divinity of Jesus, claim of a prophet after Jesus Christ, may peace be upon him.
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