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Ditch the "reputation" rankings
07-10-2009, 10:50 AM (This post was last modified: 07-10-2009 10:52 AM by MerryAtheist.)
Post: #1
Ditch the "reputation" rankings
I've been having some weird discussions with Raphael in the Science forum, and while it's fun to get snarky back and forth once in a while, and play around with others' rankings, it occurs to me that anyone who is new here could get the wrong impression from the "reputation" rankings.

There may arise a tendency (in fact, I already see signs of this in my own rankings) to rate someone negatively simply because they don't agree with you. In the end, if this trend takes off, the "reputation" rankings will be less and less about fairness, objectivity, and respect, and more about popularity.

I suggest removing the "reputation" feature from the forum because it is too misleading and open to abuse.

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07-10-2009, 10:55 AM
Post: #2
RE: Ditch the "reputation" rankings
Or just allow neutral or positive rankings. Certainly the negatives are subject to abuse.

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07-10-2009, 12:38 PM (This post was last modified: 07-10-2009 01:28 PM by Stereophonic.)
Post: #3
RE: Ditch the "reputation" rankings
And of course the "reputation" system is only part of the larger problem of abusive behavior. For example, GTseng3 has been shadowing me all over the forum for about a month now, dutifully and preemptively alerting all new users to his peculiar misunderstandings about my character. I first asked him to stop, and he refused. Then I tried ignoring him, and he pestered me to respond. What can be done to stop this sort of abuse?

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07-10-2009, 02:25 PM
Post: #4
RE: Ditch the "reputation" rankings
I've got to disagree with you, MerryAtheist. I think the reputation system generally works. I think some things could be tweaked - requiring you to have at least three stars before voting, or requiring a one-month wait period before you can "tag back" someone who rates you - but in general I've noticed that those who make logical arguments and lead to interesting discussions have a nice positive reputation, while those that don't have negative reputations.

The ones with the most negative reps are the ones who post nonsense, poor, bad grammar, etc. Next come the ones who are articulate, but abusive, illogical, or deceptive. Then moving into the positive, you come to people like you and I, who are logical but also very confrontational. And finally you have people who are absolute saints. Who are always polite, logical when they post, allowing others their views no matter how misguided. They tend to have loads of good reputation (and generally two points of it from me.)

So reputation, in general, seems to work out pretty well in the end.

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07-12-2009, 08:33 AM
Post: #5
RE: Ditch the "reputation" rankings
The rating system only can work if there is a cricial mass of people who use it responsibly. In the absence of such a critical mass, the system tends to be abused by bullies and unstable individuals. Responsible users, in such case, are forced to decide between 1) ignoring the rating system altogether since it is broken, thereby leaving the rating system almost entirely in the hands of the unstable elements; or 2) act in some way to counter the abuse, thereby exposing themselves to criticism for lowering themselves to the same level as the abusers; or 3) they can just find another forum, since the current one has become broken. Unfortunately, a number of good, responsible people seem to have abandoned this forum, perhaps for this very reason.

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07-12-2009, 02:43 PM
Post: #6
RE: Ditch the "reputation" rankings
And that would have nothing to do with your well-deserved -2 rep, would it? See my quote for more details.

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07-12-2009, 10:19 PM (This post was last modified: 07-12-2009 10:22 PM by Stereophonic.)
Post: #7
RE: Ditch the "reputation" rankings
GT, let's forget about the ratings abuse. Probably there's no way to avoid that problem on a public forum.

But will you, here and now, publicly agree to stop shadowing me all around the forum with your vague, general accusations that are unrelated to any specific elements of my posts? Certainly you are free to make all the accusations you see fit regarding specific points made, for in such case I can respond as necessary; but there is no way I can respond to repeated general attempts at character assassination, since you have nothing to back up your charges except your list of quotes which serves only to show how easily you leap from one false conclusion to another.

Please stop your abusive behavior, GT; you are not the forum's policeman. If behavior such as yours can be tolerated on this forum, then you will have succeeded at turning this forum into a circus for eratics and bullies.

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07-12-2009, 10:46 PM
Post: #8
RE: Ditch the "reputation" rankings
You're a textbook in social manipulation, Stereophonic. Those, like myself, who try to cut through political doublespeak to get to the truth can learn a lot just from studying you. Like here, for instance, when you try to re-write history to suit your means. You can see it happening in politics on the national news right now, and here we have it in microcosm.

I never shadowed you. You entered pre-existing discussions on these forums and began questioning, like any other poster. I originally gave you positive reputation because of this, and because of your insistence that logic and reason be used in discussions, even though I disagreed with your content. Then I started checking your sources, your quotes, and I began noticing your behavior, and the reputation changed. I started calling you on your BS. But I never shadowed you. I'm one of the most prolific posters on this forum, and I respond to everyone.

True, I treat them better. I treat you dismissively. I treat you with scorn. You've earned that by blatantly lying and manipulating the words of others. But I hardly "follow you around" the forum. Lately, in fact, I've been busying myself discussing things with people who are seeking the truth, beyond teasing you about your obviously hypocritical replies to Raphael's posts. And honestly, that's just for the humor. I mean, seriously, did you think that was anything but transparent? I hope you find his addition to your moniker to mine and MerryAtheist's as amusing as I do.

But I hardly persecute you. You never ask me to stop posting, before now at least, you just reply, reply, and reply, with so many lies and misquotes that it's dizzying. If anything, I have cause to want to censure you for all your false cries against me.

But I won't ask for that. Because that's part of being on an internet forum. You can be easily defused by being ignored. Dismissed. I've been trying to do that lately, rather than engaging you, except for the aforementioned amusing example. And, of course, this post, because I believe everyone should know why they're being treated poorly. It's hard for me, I'll admit that, because those who deliberately try to hide the truth really do anger me. But our constant sparring doesn't really serve any purpose, so I'm trying to stop. But if I see someone taking you at your word, I'll probably say something to them. That's not persecution, or abuse. That's simply telling them what's gone on before.

You made this bed. You get to lie in it now.

So, no more hijacking of this thread. MerryAtheist stated his opinion. I stated mine. You whined a lot. The forum admins can decide what to do. I'm going back to trying to figure out the truth. If you really want to pretend I'm singling you out, you can private message me.

And one more thing, Stereophonic - I'm too logical a person to think that all theists are like you, but if I was the sort of propaganda artist you are . . . I would. How long do you think you can keep this up before your fellow theists realize what you're doing to their reputation? I wonder if they already have. I know that when an atheist acts anything remotely like you, I send them a polite private message discussing good debating techniques vs. poor ones. But I suppose that's between you and them.

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07-14-2009, 01:15 AM (This post was last modified: 07-14-2009 01:45 AM by God Rocks.)
Post: #9
RE: Ditch the "reputation" rankings
The reputation system does have its problems, but the idea is that it will average out in the end to being fair even if each individual rating may not be.

I have decided to remove the ability to give negative reputation points. From now on you can only give neutral or positive reputation. Please let me know if you run into any technical problems with the reputation system but I think it should be working correctly.

On a side note to anyone this may apply to, might I suggest using the ignore button if there is someone who particularly annoys you?

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07-14-2009, 01:49 AM
Post: #10
RE: Ditch the "reputation" rankings
Will you then be removing the negative reputation hits that are pre-existing?

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