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Evil God Hypothesis vs Good God Hypothesis
05-06-2010, 11:19 AM
Post: #1
Evil God Hypothesis vs Good God Hypothesis
Stephen Law has came up with an Evil God Hypothesis and challenges theists to prove him wrong. It goes something like this...

Theists, particularly Christians, insist that their god is all good. Based on the empirical evidence, such as newborn babies, ability to love, the beauty of nature, and the "fine tuning" of the universe, etc, it seems that this all good god hypothesis is fairly reasonable. But when considering the empirical evidence such as miscarriages, deaths of women during child birth, the tragedies of nature, and the chaotic events of the universe, etc, the evil god hypothesis could be just as reasonable as the all good god. And yet, you deny this evil god and accept the all good god. If you can deny one then you can surely deny the other.

Please leave your response as to why you deny the evil god hypothesis and I will try to defend the evil god hypothesis to the best of my ability.
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05-06-2010, 11:59 AM
Post: #2
RE: Evil God Hypothesis vs Good God Hypothesis
I would deny the evil god for fear of his effect. Though I think that no one has an effect on me, I believe that I also would deny him for the reason of there existing good things at all. The way I would see bad stuff is as a lesson for a person to be stronger within themselves. Thus resulting in an all good universe.

Unless the good stuff is just a trick to get us to do something, lol, than the bad God is definitely not very powerful. At least to everyone except for that aborted baby, huh, which leaves me the thought of choice....is it some deep down choice to come into life as an aborted baby? Some sort of lesson like that denies any power of a Bad God.
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05-06-2010, 12:23 PM
Post: #3
RE: Evil God Hypothesis vs Good God Hypothesis
Quote:I would deny the evil god for fear of his effect.

Can you elaborate?

Quote: I believe that I also would deny him for the reason of there existing good things at all. The way I would see bad stuff is as a lesson for a person to be stronger within themselves. Thus resulting in an all good universe.

So what your saying is, why does evil god allow good things to exist? Because some evils require some goods to exist. Jealousy could not exist without something good that somebody else has to be jealous about.
Or, why create beauty? Evil god created beauty for contrast. That is, to make the ugly things appear even uglier.
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05-06-2010, 12:35 PM
Post: #4
RE: Evil God Hypothesis vs Good God Hypothesis
A good point. This is perhaps why many peoples have both a good God and a bad God- thus dualism, as in Zoroastrianism and Manichaeism.
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05-06-2010, 12:45 PM
Post: #5
RE: Evil God Hypothesis vs Good God Hypothesis
(05-06-2010 12:35 PM)Venedi Sporoi Wrote:  A good point. This is perhaps why many peoples have both a good God and a bad God- thus dualism, as in Zoroastrianism and Manichaeism.

Yes, Zoroastrianism would be the rational choice if one were to choose a religion.
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05-06-2010, 04:13 PM
Post: #6
Evil God Hypothesis vs Good God Hypothesis
Monks and nuns dedicate their lives to abstinence and peace in order to better understand God; it is rare that they decide that God is "evil".
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05-06-2010, 07:03 PM
Post: #7
RE: Evil God Hypothesis vs Good God Hypothesis
(05-06-2010 04:13 PM)RobertK Wrote:  Monks and nuns dedicate their lives to abstinence and peace in order to better understand God; it is rare that they decide that God is "evil".

I think what you're getting at is an all good god is more reasonable because of the religious experiences and revelations, correct me if I'm wrong. Why would an evil god want to give us positive religious experiences? Let's say that evil god did exist. He would appear to one group of people (culture) and reveal himself in a positive way and even give instructions on how to live life. Then he appears to another group (culture) and reveals himself in a positive way, only he appears totally different to this group than he did to the previous group, giving them different instructions on life and so on. He continues revealing himself in different manners to different cultures, each one being contradictory to the last. When he is done, he sits back and watches all of the religious wars and conflicts that he caused by misleading all of these different people. There is no denying that there have been religious wars and this is very good evidence of an evil god.
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05-06-2010, 07:53 PM
Post: #8
RE: Evil God Hypothesis vs Good God Hypothesis
(05-06-2010 11:19 AM)lostsurf9111 Wrote:  Stephen Law has came up with an Evil God Hypothesis and challenges theists to prove him wrong. It goes something like this...

Theists, particularly Christians, insist that their god is all good. Based on the empirical evidence, such as newborn babies, ability to love, the beauty of nature, and the "fine tuning" of the universe, etc, it seems that this all good god hypothesis is fairly reasonable. But when considering the empirical evidence such as miscarriages, deaths of women during child birth, the tragedies of nature, and the chaotic events of the universe, etc, the evil god hypothesis could be just as reasonable as the all good god. And yet, you deny this evil god and accept the all good god. If you can deny one then you can surely deny the other.

Please leave your response as to why you deny the evil god hypothesis and I will try to defend the evil god hypothesis to the best of my ability.

I deny the evil god hypothesis, because of several reasons...

1) It brings Bon Dieu down to a human level.
2) It ascribes human emotions to something, with no reason to do so.
3) If Bon Dieu is able to be described with human emotions, neither good nor evil could properly encapsulate. As Bon Dieu is the universe, it must exemplify the balance we see -- good and bad, pleasure and pain, chaos and order.

Pawol anpil pa leve le mo
Lavi m nan men Bondye o sen
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05-06-2010, 09:48 PM
Post: #9
RE: Evil God Hypothesis vs Good God Hypothesis
Quote:1) It brings Bon Dieu down to a human level.
2) It ascribes human emotions to something, with no reason to do so.

You need to explain these first two things in detail because I'm not sure what you're saying.

Quote:3) If Bon Dieu is able to be described with human emotions, neither good nor evil could properly encapsulate. As Bon Dieu is the universe, it must exemplify the balance we see -- good and bad, pleasure and pain, chaos and order.

Are you saying good god is both good and bad. If so, then this challenge isn't directed at you. It is directed to those who insist that there is an all good god.
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05-06-2010, 10:59 PM
Post: #10
RE: Evil God Hypothesis vs Good God Hypothesis
My point is that when you're talking about something like God, it's foolish to attempt and ascribe things like "good" and "bad" to it. We can't know that there is a god, and even if we believe in one or more -- we cannot exceed human understanding. We anthropomorphize things to better try to understand it, we have to bring things up or down to our level so we can grasp at something that's neither human nor divine.

No one can comprehend the will of any god, no one can know the mind of any god -- one certainly can't know the motives of anyone other then ourselves, certainly not something which by any god hypothesis would be non-human. To try to ascribe emotions or assign motives to something we do not have a full understanding of is pure hubris, and an exercise in futility.

At this point, I'm simply giving you my theistic viewpoint, as you asked for. You did not aim your challenge at anyone other than theists -- I assumed what you meant, but if I waited for people to post challenges to non-Christians, I'd be constantly waiting.

So therefore, taking part in the discussion.

Pawol anpil pa leve le mo
Lavi m nan men Bondye o sen
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