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God as Distinct
07-13-2013, 11:10 AM
Post: #1
God as Distinct
Hi all
I'm just learning my way around so if this has been raised elsewhere, someone please feel free to point me to it.

Our language for God tends to make God separate from us/the world. Even religions that envision God in various aspects, rather than monotheism's "one God", anthropomorphize those aspects.

As a consequence, we use language like "spiritual journey", or "destination" to describe our relationship, or hoped for relationship, with God.

What impact on your perspective would it have to eliminate all reference to God as distinct from us/the world and to consider oneness as a current, and constant, state?

Thanks for any thoughts
David
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07-13-2013, 02:51 PM
Post: #2
RE: God as Distinct
(07-13-2013 11:10 AM)davek121 Wrote:  Hi all
I'm just learning my way around so if this has been raised elsewhere, someone please feel free to point me to it.
Our language for God tends to make God separate from us/the world. Even religions that envision God in various aspects, rather than monotheism's "one God", anthropomorphize those aspects.
As a consequence, we use language like "spiritual journey", or "destination" to describe our relationship, or hoped for relationship, with God.
What impact on your perspective would it have to eliminate all reference to God as distinct from us/the world and to consider oneness as a current, and constant, state?
Thanks for any thoughts
David

As far as language: in 'Bible speak' at Zephaniah 3 v 9 it mentions God's people would speak a 'pure language'......

Where in Scripture does language make God separate....
That 'pure language' would be the spiritual words as found in Scripture transending all earth's languages. So, no matter what language or mother tongue one has he can come to have an accurate knowledge or education as found in Scripture. - John 17 v 3. Come to learn or know what the Bible really teaches.

What oneness as a current and constant state would there be outside of Scripture ?
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07-13-2013, 05:14 PM (This post was last modified: 07-13-2013 05:23 PM by Yefet.)
Post: #3
RE: God as Distinct
What he is talking about here Ura has nothing to do with Language but more with pride and humility
Welcome to the forum dave, really good first post
you have just described Chassidut or my world in a nutshell
Because of mans feelings of existence or being he cannot stand the thought of something or someone else taking away from that existence, so all of creation including other people is seen as nothing but an opponent and there is only two ways he can deal with it, make up an outside deity that doesn't take away from himself so he see's himself as a humble man and looks upon it as something greater than himself or he remains proud and thinks he is greater than you, It how man deals with other men and his God he cannot help but compare himself to everything else or anyone he meets
But Chassidut teaches that there is no need for a comparison in the first place, and true Humility starts when he is able to see himself as nothing at all or bittul bim’tziut, if you will. It takes time and hits the Ego right between the eyes but he soon realizes that he, his being or existence and the rest of creation and the other people and things are actually the same thing ! This then is the Chassidic conception of God and man all ultimately being one. I was raised to think this way, the Idea of a separate entity or deity from us is as foreign to me as you can get, the impact would be the human Ego is not yet mature enough to handle this concept it still needs room for itself or an outside deity in order to grow , but we are getting there as you would not have made this thread without the thought being planted in the first place, Great thread Dave
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07-14-2013, 05:23 PM (This post was last modified: 07-14-2013 05:41 PM by davek121.)
Post: #4
RE: God as Distinct
(07-13-2013 02:51 PM)URAVIP2ME Wrote:  
(07-13-2013 11:10 AM)davek121 Wrote:  What impact on your perspective would it have to eliminate all reference to God as distinct from us/the world and to consider oneness as a current, and constant, state?
Thanks for any thoughts
David

Where in Scripture does language make God separate....
hi Ura.
What I was getting at falls sort of between what you're asking and what Yefet is suggesting. The majority of language in Scripture makes God separate. We can start at Genesis, where the Elohim Yahweh walks with Adam and Eve in the Garden. That's an image that's not possible if God is inseverable and indivisible with us.
But it requires us to think of God in terms other than as a "person". I'm curious as to how that perspective changes our understanding of our relationship with Creation.

Hope that's a little clearer.
Thanks for your reply
David

(07-13-2013 05:14 PM)Yefet Wrote:  It takes time and hits the Ego right between the eyes but he soon realizes that he, his being or existence and the rest of creation and the other people and things are actually the same thing ! This then is the Chassidic conception of God and man all ultimately being one.
Yeah, that pretty much gets to the gist of what I was aiming at Smile

Obviously, you're into this considerably more deeply than my opening post was aimed at. I'm not familiar with much more than the name Chassidut and I appreciate the opportunity to learn more. I hadn't realized until I read your post and did a little reading how well it fit with my thinking on this topic.

I was taking it at a very mild (I don't want to use the word "superficial") level. I was thinking of it as a kind of exercise in perception. Take a segment of sacred text from a faith tradition where God is described as separate, such as the Genesis passage I mentioned in my reply to Ura. It could as easily be from any other faith/religion. Then try rewording the passage, removing the distinction between God and humanity/Creation.

So I'm curious to know if this would be something that would be part of studying/exploring Chassidism?

Thanks for the warm welcome
David
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