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How old is monotheism?
01-18-2010, 10:22 PM (This post was last modified: 01-18-2010 11:02 PM by Venedi Sporoi.)
Post: #1
How old is monotheism?
A debate has been started on the "Who Created the Universe?" thread that I would rather see with its own thread, seeing as the discussion doesn't seem to have died out yet. I, like many, have heard the claims that all polytheistic religions are the result of confusion or deception, and that the first religion was the religion of the creator alone. This is not to say that no polytheistic faith hints at a supreme creator, and I'll concede to those who disagree that my own does, but not a jealous one who envies the worship of his children, "sons of the most high", as Psalm 82 would say.

In my opinion, historical examples supporting the rise of monotheism from polytheism are ready at hand, and some have already been used. There was the Egyptian Atenism, which arose after eons of Egyptian polytheism dating back to the dawn of recorded history. There is also Zoroastrianism, which supplanted the old Iranian Daeva-worship of Gods with old Indo-Iranian roots like Indra and Sarva, later listed as demons.

It seems that Judaism almost stands alone in antiquity; if it had a pagan predecessor, then it erased it more effectively than the others, but even so, there seem to be hints. We can still find remnants of henotheism in Exodus 12:12, Isaiah 19:1, where the God of Moses is actually overpowering the Gods of Egypt, or Psalm 82. The continued hints at plurality in word usage (The use of "we", as biomystic pointed out), and the fact that angels are really just obedient "Elohim" (Gods) makes monotheism look fairly new compared with the sea of animism and polytheism, from Sumer to Hawaii, from 3000 B.C. to the 1800's.

With that, I've said my piece, and I'd like to hear what some would like to say in response or regarding this argument in general.
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01-18-2010, 10:51 PM (This post was last modified: 01-18-2010 11:11 PM by catholicstation.)
Post: #2
RE: How old is monotheism?
RE: How old is monotheism?

When i leave Purgatory and make it to Heaven - I will ask G-D !
=====================================
In the mean time
How old is a Pine tree?
How old is an Oak tree?
How old is?
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01-19-2010, 12:20 AM
Post: #3
RE: How old is monotheism?
Unfortunalty for you, all Catholics will be staying in purgatory. As no amount of time in purgatory will erase their sins.
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01-19-2010, 12:40 AM
Post: #4
RE: How old is monotheism?
(01-18-2010 10:22 PM)Venedi Sporoi Wrote:  It seems that Judaism almost stands alone in antiquity; if it had a pagan predecessor, then it erased it more effectively than the others, but even so, there seem to be hints. We can still find remnants of henotheism in Exodus 12:12, Isaiah 19:1, where the God of Moses is actually overpowering the Gods of Egypt, or Psalm 82. The continued hints at plurality in word usage (The use of "we", as biomystic pointed out), and the fact that angels are really just obedient "Elohim" (Gods) makes monotheism look fairly new compared with the sea of animism and polytheism, from Sumer to Hawaii, from 3000 B.C. to the 1800's.

Uh, Canaanite polytheism does have recorded archeological presence, long before the Jews settled. Less well known, certainly, but we're around.
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01-19-2010, 01:16 AM (This post was last modified: 01-19-2010 01:24 AM by catholicstation.)
Post: #5
RE: How old is monotheism?
(01-19-2010 12:20 AM)Phill Wrote:  Unfortunalty for you, all Catholics will be staying in purgatory. As no amount of time in purgatory will erase their sins.

See You do not understand "Purgatory" - Only "saved" imperfect Christians will enter - thier sins are already forgiven and paid for

Because Someone else writes the check -
Does not mean You have "NO OBLIGATION"
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01-19-2010, 01:29 AM (This post was last modified: 01-19-2010 01:30 AM by Venedi Sporoi.)
Post: #6
RE: How old is monotheism?
(01-19-2010 12:40 AM)Merit Wrote:  
(01-18-2010 10:22 PM)Venedi Sporoi Wrote:  It seems that Judaism almost stands alone in antiquity; if it had a pagan predecessor, then it erased it more effectively than the others, but even so, there seem to be hints. We can still find remnants of henotheism in Exodus 12:12, Isaiah 19:1, where the God of Moses is actually overpowering the Gods of Egypt, or Psalm 82. The continued hints at plurality in word usage (The use of "we", as biomystic pointed out), and the fact that angels are really just obedient "Elohim" (Gods) makes monotheism look fairly new compared with the sea of animism and polytheism, from Sumer to Hawaii, from 3000 B.C. to the 1800's.

Uh, Canaanite polytheism does have recorded archeological presence, long before the Jews settled. Less well known, certainly, but we're around.

That's true, but it's a bit of a muddle what exactly the Jews were. There's certainly a suggestion that the founders of Judaism arrived after the Canaanites from somewhere else, as Exodus claims, rather than with them. It's worth including in the list of "hints" at an original polytheism, but I still feel it's less defined than with the others.
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01-19-2010, 01:31 AM
Post: #7
RE: How old is monotheism?
(01-19-2010 01:29 AM)Venedi Sporoi Wrote:  
(01-19-2010 12:40 AM)Merit Wrote:  
(01-18-2010 10:22 PM)Venedi Sporoi Wrote:  It seems that Judaism almost stands alone in antiquity; if it had a pagan predecessor, then it erased it more effectively than the others, but even so, there seem to be hints. We can still find remnants of henotheism in Exodus 12:12, Isaiah 19:1, where the God of Moses is actually overpowering the Gods of Egypt, or Psalm 82. The continued hints at plurality in word usage (The use of "we", as biomystic pointed out), and the fact that angels are really just obedient "Elohim" (Gods) makes monotheism look fairly new compared with the sea of animism and polytheism, from Sumer to Hawaii, from 3000 B.C. to the 1800's.

Uh, Canaanite polytheism does have recorded archeological presence, long before the Jews settled. Less well known, certainly, but we're around.

That's true, but it's a bit of a muddle what exactly the Jews were. There's certainly a suggestion that the founders of Judaism arrived after the Canaanites from somewhere else, as Exodus claims, rather than with them. It's worth including in the list of "hints" at an original polytheism, but I still feel it's less defined than with the others.

As a Canaanite polytheist with a very Jewish background -- what makes you feel so?
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01-19-2010, 01:45 AM
Post: #8
RE: How old is monotheism?
(01-19-2010 01:31 AM)Merit Wrote:  
(01-19-2010 01:29 AM)Venedi Sporoi Wrote:  
(01-19-2010 12:40 AM)Merit Wrote:  
(01-18-2010 10:22 PM)Venedi Sporoi Wrote:  It seems that Judaism almost stands alone in antiquity; if it had a pagan predecessor, then it erased it more effectively than the others, but even so, there seem to be hints. We can still find remnants of henotheism in Exodus 12:12, Isaiah 19:1, where the God of Moses is actually overpowering the Gods of Egypt, or Psalm 82. The continued hints at plurality in word usage (The use of "we", as biomystic pointed out), and the fact that angels are really just obedient "Elohim" (Gods) makes monotheism look fairly new compared with the sea of animism and polytheism, from Sumer to Hawaii, from 3000 B.C. to the 1800's.

Uh, Canaanite polytheism does have recorded archeological presence, long before the Jews settled. Less well known, certainly, but we're around.

That's true, but it's a bit of a muddle what exactly the Jews were. There's certainly a suggestion that the founders of Judaism arrived after the Canaanites from somewhere else, as Exodus claims, rather than with them. It's worth including in the list of "hints" at an original polytheism, but I still feel it's less defined than with the others.

As a Canaanite polytheist with a very Jewish background -- what makes you feel so?

It does not matter what a "Canaanite polytheist" Thinks - The Torah was transmitted by "Divine Revelation"
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01-19-2010, 01:53 AM
Post: #9
RE: How old is monotheism?
(01-19-2010 01:45 AM)catholicstation Wrote:  
(01-19-2010 01:31 AM)Merit Wrote:  
(01-19-2010 01:29 AM)Venedi Sporoi Wrote:  
(01-19-2010 12:40 AM)Merit Wrote:  
(01-18-2010 10:22 PM)Venedi Sporoi Wrote:  It seems that Judaism almost stands alone in antiquity; if it had a pagan predecessor, then it erased it more effectively than the others, but even so, there seem to be hints. We can still find remnants of henotheism in Exodus 12:12, Isaiah 19:1, where the God of Moses is actually overpowering the Gods of Egypt, or Psalm 82. The continued hints at plurality in word usage (The use of "we", as biomystic pointed out), and the fact that angels are really just obedient "Elohim" (Gods) makes monotheism look fairly new compared with the sea of animism and polytheism, from Sumer to Hawaii, from 3000 B.C. to the 1800's.

Uh, Canaanite polytheism does have recorded archeological presence, long before the Jews settled. Less well known, certainly, but we're around.

That's true, but it's a bit of a muddle what exactly the Jews were. There's certainly a suggestion that the founders of Judaism arrived after the Canaanites from somewhere else, as Exodus claims, rather than with them. It's worth including in the list of "hints" at an original polytheism, but I still feel it's less defined than with the others.

As a Canaanite polytheist with a very Jewish background -- what makes you feel so?

It does not matter what a "Canaanite polytheist" Thinks - The Torah was transmitted by "Divine Revelation"

The Torah wasn't transmitted until long after polytheism existed, so if you're going by the Torah, you're talking over 2,000 years into the Jewish calender. 1312 BCE, any Jew will tell you that. The Pentateuch is considered the most holy word of G-d.

/Jewish lesson.
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01-19-2010, 01:57 AM (This post was last modified: 01-19-2010 02:02 AM by catholicstation.)
Post: #10
RE: How old is monotheism?
(01-19-2010 01:53 AM)Merit Wrote:  
(01-19-2010 01:45 AM)catholicstation Wrote:  
(01-19-2010 01:31 AM)Merit Wrote:  
(01-19-2010 01:29 AM)Venedi Sporoi Wrote:  
(01-19-2010 12:40 AM)Merit Wrote:  
(01-18-2010 10:22 PM)Venedi Sporoi Wrote:  It seems that Judaism almost stands alone in antiquity; if it had a pagan predecessor, then it erased it more effectively than the others, but even so, there seem to be hints. We can still find remnants of henotheism in Exodus 12:12, Isaiah 19:1, where the God of Moses is actually overpowering the Gods of Egypt, or Psalm 82. The continued hints at plurality in word usage (The use of "we", as biomystic pointed out), and the fact that angels are really just obedient "Elohim" (Gods) makes monotheism look fairly new compared with the sea of animism and polytheism, from Sumer to Hawaii, from 3000 B.C. to the 1800's.

Uh, Canaanite polytheism does have recorded archeological presence, long before the Jews settled. Less well known, certainly, but we're around.

That's true, but it's a bit of a muddle what exactly the Jews were. There's certainly a suggestion that the founders of Judaism arrived after the Canaanites from somewhere else, as Exodus claims, rather than with them. It's worth including in the list of "hints" at an original polytheism, but I still feel it's less defined than with the others.

As a Canaanite polytheist with a very Jewish background -- what makes you feel so?

It does not matter what a "Canaanite polytheist" Thinks - The Torah was transmitted by "Divine Revelation"

The Torah wasn't transmitted until long after polytheism existed, so if you're going by the Torah, you're talking over 2,000 years into the Jewish calender. 1312 BCE, any Jew will tell you that. The Pentateuch is considered the most holy word of G-d.

/Jewish lesson.

The Torah wasn't transmitted until long after polytheism existed
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I do do not worship rocks like you

"Theosophy" is the word You are looking for
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