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Let us check Stereophonic's creativity
03-18-2010, 07:12 AM (This post was last modified: 03-18-2010 07:12 AM by Ahmadi.)
Post: #1
Let us check Stereophonic's creativity
Among the critics of Paul the Apostle was President Thomas Jefferson who wrote that Paul was the "first corrupter of the doctrines of Jesus.

There are several passages in the New Testament highlighting the importance of the 'Law.' This introduces a fundamental contradiction in the New Testament when we read these passages along with those where Paul opposes the 'Law.'

For example note this passage, which is a part of the Sermon on the Mount, from New International Version:

Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven. (Mathew 5:17-20)

Also read Luke 4:4, Mathew 19:16-18 and John 15:10.

I am second coming of Thomas Paine. If you are a Christian, have you read Age of Reason?
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03-18-2010, 07:39 AM
Post: #2
RE: Let us check Stereophonic's creativity
(03-18-2010 07:12 AM)Ahmadi Wrote:  Among the critics of Paul the Apostle was President Thomas Jefferson who wrote that Paul was the "first corrupter of the doctrines of Jesus.

There are several passages in the New Testament highlighting the importance of the 'Law.' This introduces a fundamental contradiction in the New Testament when we read these passages along with those where Paul opposes the 'Law.'

For example note this passage, which is a part of the Sermon on the Mount, from New International Version:

Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven. (Mathew 5:17-20)

Also read Luke 4:4, Mathew 19:16-18 and John 15:10.

Because you are not a Christian but a Muslim who has been thoroughly brainwashed by Muhammad's ideas, you don't know what Jesus was talking about. If you read the Gospels closely you will find Jesus made no bones about changing how Jews respond to the Law. Of course, one cannot make sense of Jesus' teachings about this or about his role in history unless you know the Law and why he chose to revision it, tossing out most of it to whittle the Law down to humanitarian size as the Two Great Commandments. You have to think about the Torah/Tanakh as you would DNA in which most all the genetic code is turned off with only a small percentage actually forming the features of the species. Yet without the full DNA code which contains memory of past species forms the present species form cannot happen. It's the same with the spiritual predecessors of Jesus. You cannot understand Jesus' teachings without knowing his roots but that doesn't mean he's bound by those roots.

Muslims are at a disadvantage about understanding this because their spiritual root is in one man's opinions. He wasn't Jewish but having lot's of ego he thought he could tell Jews how they should believe just he did Christians. Muhammad and Muslims remain outsiders because they were never Jews or Christians and can only piggy-back on Jewish/Christian religious authority.
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03-18-2010, 08:19 AM (This post was last modified: 03-18-2010 08:29 AM by Stereophonic.)
Post: #3
RE: Let us check Stereophonic's creativity
One of the issues we have to deal with is how Jesus and Paul used the term "Law." In some contexts it refers to the civil laws of Moses. In these cases Jesus sometimes strengthened the law--i.e., not just the physical act of adultery is wrong, but so is the lust that precedes the act--and other times he relaxes it--i.e., there is nothing wrong with doing good "works" for suffering people and animals on the Sabbath. Both Jesus and Paul hold people to a stricter standard than the Mosaic civil law, in part by jettisoning those laws that were merely concessions to human hard-heartedness (e.g., divorce) and in part by looking not just at external actions, but also at the more important attitude of the heart.

In other contexts the "Law" refers to the sacrificial laws of Moses. These laws never applied to non-Jewish people, and in any case they have been wholely inoperative ever since the Jewish temple was destroyed in 70 AD. As both Jesus and Paul knew, the sacrificial laws were in part intended to point to the sacrifice of Jesus, and in this sense Jesus completely "fulfilled" the sacrificial law, once and for all, in his own person.

Finally, Paul very often uses "Law" as a term to describe the natural human tendency to say, "Okay, what is the minimum standard to which I must adhere in order to be counted righteous by God" (an example here from modern life is when a Muslim man gets around the "no adultery" laws of Islam by "marrying" a woman, satisifying himself with her, and then divorcing her within ten minutes). Both Jesus and Paul agree that this use of "Law" runs entirely contrary to God's intentions--and in fact people who rely on the "Law" in this way have placed themselves far from the Kingdom of God.

http://www.biblicaltraining.org/ --- http://www.ntwrightpage.com/
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03-18-2010, 08:36 AM (This post was last modified: 03-18-2010 08:41 AM by Ahmadi.)
Post: #4
RE: Let us check Stereophonic's creativity
Let me agree with a portion of Stereophonic, as he highlights the teaching of Jesus, as he stressed, 'not just at external actions, but also at the more important attitude of the heart.' There is a very famous saying of the Holy Prophet Muhammad that is memorized by most Muslims, in Arabic even if they are non-Arabs, "Actions are judged by the motives."

Let each reader try to resolve the issue of 'Law,' in light of the understanding of Jews, Ebionites and Jesus on one hand and Paul on the other. More on this issue later.

Here let me just answer one of the questions that Stereophonic raised.

Most practicing Muslims condemn looking for any loop holes in religious law, or keeping the letter and avoiding the spirit. At times followers of all Abrahmaic faiths have been guilty of that and most of us, as it pertains to Form 1040 of USA tax laws. We do not need to isolate Muslims as an example of this, this is a human vulnerability that we all need to try to avoid.

I am second coming of Thomas Paine. If you are a Christian, have you read Age of Reason?
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