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Thanks Shimei
05-15-2011, 06:42 PM
Post: #1
Thanks Shimei
Thanks Shimei ,
I am totally ignorant concerning christian theology
did not want to hijack other thread
Is it common line of thought that Jesus could make or change law?
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05-15-2011, 06:58 PM (This post was last modified: 05-15-2011 07:41 PM by Shimei.)
Post: #2
RE: Thanks Shimei
Hello Yefet,

I am not a theologian, but from my own understanding Jesus Christ, the Son shares the same authority as the Father and Holy Spirit as they are one in essence and called the Godhead. Jesus was not created like that of an angel or seraph, He came forth from God into glory as His only begotten Son.

His purpose however, was not to abolish the law but to fufill the law and prophecy. The purpose of the law once again from my understanding is to demonstrate to us our sin nature, for one cannot keep all the commandments, only the perfect man could, and that's Jesus Christ.

If that means that Jesus could abolish the Law then I say yes, but why abolish perfection? Did He? I am unaware of Him doing so, only the ceremonial laws, not the moral laws, therefore a second covenant has been declared (I think in Hebrews), mainly for the first covenant's misrepresentation by man.

I'm all ears and hope to learn as I take a tremendous delight in Judeo-Christianity. What's your take?
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05-15-2011, 08:36 PM (This post was last modified: 05-15-2011 08:53 PM by Yefet.)
Post: #3
RE: Thanks Shimei
Sorry took so long I wanted to read Matthew before responding.
I don’t pretend to understand the concept of Jesus as a messiah and don’t want to go into that ,but what I read was basically Jesus enforcing Deuteronomy 6:5 and Leviticus 19:18
The only difference I see is the views of salvation differ, but there remains a shared moral principle.
halakhah is based on the covenant between God and Israel, We do not believe in a second covenant, so its hard for me to even comprehend such a thing.
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05-15-2011, 08:53 PM (This post was last modified: 05-15-2011 10:32 PM by Shimei.)
Post: #4
RE: Thanks Shimei
Hebrews 8 is the whereabouts of the reference made in regards to the second cov. In the difference of salvation I would say that in Christianity salvation comes by grace through faith in Jesus Christ. By placing our faith in Christ we stand before God in righteousness. And I will not go futher by special request. Smile

What is faith then? Action based on belief sustained by confidence in God. Our salvational views may differ, for eg., one may not relate to God in His mercy for forgiveness of those whose intentions are upright. The NT, however, unambiguously proclaims the finality of Jesus Christ. And I will not go further by special request. Smile

Thanks Yefet, look forward to hearing from you in the future, at your convenience of course.
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05-15-2011, 09:54 PM
Post: #5
RE: Thanks Shimei
Do you follow Leviticus 19:18, either of you?
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05-15-2011, 10:12 PM (This post was last modified: 05-15-2011 10:16 PM by Shimei.)
Post: #6
RE: Thanks Shimei
(05-15-2011 09:54 PM)Pacioli Wrote:  Do you follow Leviticus 19:18, either of you?

Imitatio Dei--To live a life of holiness as defined for a human being, because God is holy.

To our best ability, I think that this commandment is one that brings upon us health and peace of mind. To not bare a grudge is not to carry about hate within, to let someone ruin our years as a youth, would be to let that person destroy our lives in the future if unforgivably held; to maintain hostility over time. One must not go on feeling anger, resentment, or a grudge against someone. It is destruction to one's energy and one's spirit.

Deuteronomy 32:35 says "Vengeance and recompense are mine," that is the Lord's.

And how about you Pacioli?
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05-15-2011, 10:25 PM
Post: #7
RE: Thanks Shimei
Well Pacioli,
I realize you are trying to get a rise,It is ok because I love to talk about positive Mitzvot
Its called 'g'milut hasadim', acts which one does with one's person, it little things like comfort mourners, bury the dead, to provide for a bride, or simply bear one's shoulder
they are included in the commandment "You shall love your fellow person as yourself” I personally have fallen short on several occasions and I am sure I will in the future ,but for the most part I try to follow Mishneh.
I know you call me hypocrite, Because one stumbles and he has fallen from his religion, that’s ok It my relationship with Hashem that I am more concerned with .
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05-16-2011, 02:09 AM
Post: #8
RE: Thanks Shimei
My error. I had meant to refer to Leviticus 19:19, not 19:18.

Thus, I was not trying to get a rise on the grudge verse and intended no imputation whatsoever. I simply referred to the wrong verse. In answer to Shimei, yes, I consider that sentiment a part of human ethics.

Now, back to the verse straight after 19:18, which I will quote for convenience:
Leviticus 19:19 Wrote:You shall keep my statutes. You shall not let your cattle breed with a different kind. You shall not sow your field with two kinds of seed, nor shall you wear a garment of cloth made of two kinds of material.

This of course I do not consider a part of human ethics Smile so I am curious to know whether you give it as much weight as you do the preceding verse, 19:18.
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05-16-2011, 07:59 AM
Post: #9
RE: Thanks Shimei
Yes, I follow the law of shatnez, to a Hasid it means more then mixing wool and linen in the same garment, it is a symbol of mixing divinity with impurity,it comes from the story that Cain brought God flax seeds, and Abel brought sheep. After Cain killed Abel, God decreed that "the offering of the sinner should not be mixed with the offering of the innocent from Midrash B'reishit 9:9
I don’t however own cattle nor do I have any fields to sow But if I did I would like to think I would remain Kosher
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05-16-2011, 08:13 AM
Post: #10
RE: Thanks Shimei
And yet Yefi it's you who teaches us that these writings are spiritual in nature and not of the physical world. Old habits die hard for the Hasid and the Catholic alike, I think.

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