Post Reply 
 
Thread Rating:
  • 1 Votes - 1 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
The Beginning...as written (second try)
04-04-2011, 11:15 AM (This post was last modified: 04-04-2011 11:37 AM by whirlwind.)
Post: #1
Big Grin The Beginning...as written (second try)
Most of us have been taught since childhood that the earth is six thousand years old, that Eve took a bite of an apple, that all men are from Adam and that Noah and his family were the only ones on the ark. NONE OF THAT IS TRUE! Concerning the beginning our Father tells us....


11 Peter 3:5-7 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water: Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished: But the heavens and the earth which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.


Let us not be "willingly ignorant" of what He teaches. The previous world/age, the "world that then was"....PERISHED. This world age didn't perish with the flood of Noah. And the flood of Noah didn't upset the heavens but the previous destruction did! We begin at...the beginning:


Genesis 1:1-2 In the (a) beginning God created the heaven and the earth. And the earth was (became) without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep.


We aren't told when the "beginning" was. Science tells us it is millions or billions of years old. We don't know the age but it is obvious that it is not six thousand years. When God created everything He didn't create it "without form and void." Nor did He place darkness over the deep. Darkness is simply another name for Satan. The world "that then was" was without His Light. We know it wasn't created in chaos for He tells us....


Isaiah 45:18 For thus saith the LORD That created the heavens; God Himself That formed it, He created it not in vain, He formed it to be inhabited: "I am the LORD; and there is none else.


In "vain" means...tohu and is the same word for "without form" used in [Genesis 1:1]. The earth became this way......


Quote:#8414 tohuw; from an unused root mean. to lie waste; a desolation (of surface), i.e. desert; fig. a worthless thing; adv. in vain: - confusion, empty place, without form, nothing, (thing of) nought, vain, vanity, waste, wilderness.


As you see, a great deal happened between the beginning, the very beginning, and the last part of [Genesis 1:2] when, "And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters." What happened and what caused that event? What happened to end that previous age, the one of the dinosaurs? We know there was one for....it is written! So, why and how?


Matthew 13:35 That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying, "I will open My mouth in parables; I will utter things which have been kept SECRET FROM THE FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD."

Quote:Foundation #2602 katabole, from 2598: a deposition, i.e. founding: fig. conception: - conceive, foundation. #2598 kataballo, from 2596 and 906: to throw down, cast down, descend, fall (down), lay. It comes from #2596 kata, which lists many applications but frequently denotes opposition, distribution or intensity.



From a study by E.W. Bullinger about the "foundation."

Quote:There are two words translated "foundation" in the New Testament. 1. Themelios and 2.katabole. (snip) A comparison of various passages using the word, but especially [2 Corinthians 4:9 and Revelation 12:10] will show that kataballo and katabole are NOT the proper terms for founding and foundation, but the correct meaning is casting down, or overthrow. Accordingly, the noun katabole, derived from, and cognate with the verb, ought to be translated "disruption, or ruin."

The remarkable thing is that in all occurrences (except Heb.11:11) the word is connected with "the world," kosmos and therefore the expression should be rendered, "the disruption, or ruin, of the world, clearly referring to the condition indicated in Genesis 1:2 and described in 2 Peter 3:5-6, for the earth was not created tohu (Is.45:18) but became so, as stated in the Hebrew of Gen. 1:2 and confirmed by 2 Peter 3:6, where "the world that then was by the word of God," (Gen.1:1) perished, and "the heavens and the earth which are now," by the same word" were created (Gen.2:4) and are kept in store," reserved unto fire against the day of judgment," (2 Peter 3:7) which shall usher in the "new heavens and the new earth" of 2 Peter 3:13.


With the kataballo, the overthrow, God flooded the earth and that age ended. It was so violent that the plates, which had been one land mass, split. As proof....today we find the skeletons of African camels, rhino's, etc. in.....Nebraska!

The following is not scripture but, the "Book of Jasher" is quoted twice in the Old Testament. [Joshua 10:13 and 2 Samuel 1:18]. Some credence therefore should probably be given to....


Jasher was the son of Caleb, a contemporary of Moses. He was speaking of the creation and said in [1:4-5], "And the abyss fled before the face of the light, and divided between the light and the darkness, so that the face of nature was formed a second time."


Further Biblical proof of a previous age is found in....

Jeremiah 4:22-23 For My people is foolish, they have not known Me; they are sottish children and they have none understanding: they are wise to do evil, but to do good they have no knowledge. I beheld the earth, and, lo, it was (became) without form, and void; and the heavens, and they had no light.

4:25-27 I beheld, and lo, there was no man, and all the birds of the heavens were fled. I beheld, and, lo, the fruitful place was a wilderness, and all the cities thereof were broken down at the presence of the Lord, and by His fierce anger. For thus hath the Lord said, "The whole land shall be desolate; yet will I not make a full end.



We see that there was a previous age and God's anger destroyed it. Then "there was no man" and "no birds." This is not the flood of Noah being discussed. And, in that previous age....there were CITIES! This was the "casting down and overthrow," the "foundation" that has been kept secret. But, now we know.

What caused God's great anger? Why did He destroy His creation?



.

From the previous post we see that there was a world age before our present age. We saw that the world was destroyed in what is termed the....katabole, an intense throwing down of the earth. He destroyed all that was on it. Why? What or who caused His furious anger?


Tyrus means....rock. Our Saviour is The Rock of our salvation. Who is the fake rock?


Deuteronomy 32:4,31,33 He is the Rock, His work is perfect: For all His ways are judgment: A GOD of truth and without iniquity, Just and right is He. (31) For their rock is not as our Rock, Even our enemies themselves being judges (33) Their wine is the poison of dragons, And the cruel venom of asps.


Satan...the dragon, the serpent is...the king of Tyrus the fake rock.


Ezekiel 28:12-13 "Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus, and say unto him, 'Thus saith the Lord GOD; 'Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty. Thou has been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou was created.



Satan, the king of Tyrus walked in Eden...this is before this present age. Notice that he was not born but was created.


28:14-15 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so; thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire. Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.


God loved Satan and set him above all others until...iniquity was found in him. What did he do?


28:18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.



What did he "traffick" in? Souls of men. His pompous pride and ego made him believe he was GOD or better than GOD. He wants the worship that belongs to our Father.

Revelation 13:17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

18:13 And cinnamon, and odours, and ointments, and frankincense, and wine, and oil, and fine flour, and wheat, and beasts, and sheep, and horses, and chariots, and slaves, and souls of men.


The buying and selling being spoken of is that of our souls....not peanut butter and jelly. That is the "trafficking" that brought Satan's downfall. Satan gathered souls, possibly through deception...just as he gathers many from God now, and there was a rebellion.


Ezekiel 28:2 "Son of man, say unto the prince of Tyrus, 'Thus saith the Lord GOD; 'Because thine heart is lifted up, and thou hast said, 'I am a GOD, I sit in the seat of God, in the midst of the seas;' yet thou art a man, and not GOD, though thou set thine heart as the heart of God:



Here we see he has been demoted....from king to prince. First age to this age. He is now, prince of this world.


John 14:30 Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in Me.


This was the reason for the overthrow, the katabole of the earth, when God destroyed it. Satan and his fellow rebelling angels fought against God and those that stood with Him. Instead of destroying His children He destroyed the age and began anew. But, this time...we are born in flesh bodies. In the first age we were all just as we will be in the next age....incorruptible spirit bodies. In our "created" bodies we are the same spirit/soul that has been from the beginning but in flesh during this age to see who we choose. Will it be Satan or our Father? Knowing that gives deeper meaning to...


John 3:3,5,13 Jesus answered and said unto him, "Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God." (5) Jesus answered, "Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. (13) And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but He That came down from heaven, even the Son of man Which is in heaven.



We must pass through this life through a flesh birth. We must be "born again" and that means....born from above and not come to earth as the fallen angels did [Genesis 6 and Jude 6]. We must be born of water, the bag of waters from birth, and...of the spirit.

Some wonder about the elect and why they/we are predestined. It is because they/we are those that stood with Him in that rebellion. And, we will stand with Him again at the end of this age.


Genesis 2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.


We have always been a soul but when we receive His breath of life....we are then a living soul, spiritually alive.


This world is ancient but this present age is much younger. The fossils we find belong to the animals and creatures of the previous age and we were there but we were not in flesh bodies...therefore no human skeletons dating from the previous age are found.



.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
04-04-2011, 02:04 PM (This post was last modified: 04-04-2011 02:05 PM by Visqueen.)
Post: #2
RE: The Beginning...as written (second try)
(04-04-2011 11:15 AM)whirlwind Wrote:  Most of us have been taught since childhood that the earth is six thousand years old, that Eve took a bite of an apple, that all men are from Adam and that Noah and his family were the only ones on the ark.

Well actually Whirl, I don't believe that you are correct here. I don't think given the current makeup of the board that a majority of posters would lay claim to a fundamentalist Christian upbringing immersed in literal belief of every word in the bible. I could be wrong, but I think a poll would show otherwise.

You have made a massive assumption.


Plus that's quite a bit of copy paste, don't you think?
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
04-04-2011, 02:23 PM
Post: #3
RE: The Beginning...as written (second try)
(04-04-2011 02:04 PM)Visqueen Wrote:  
(04-04-2011 11:15 AM)whirlwind Wrote:  Most of us have been taught since childhood that the earth is six thousand years old, that Eve took a bite of an apple, that all men are from Adam and that Noah and his family were the only ones on the ark.

Well actually Whirl, I don't believe that you are correct here. I don't think given the current makeup of the board that a majority of posters would lay claim to a fundamentalist Christian upbringing immersed in literal belief of every word in the bible. I could be wrong, but I think a poll would show otherwise.

You have made a massive assumption.


Plus that's quite a bit of copy paste, don't you think?



LOL....that's it? All that to read and that was the comment?

Okay, let's take the assumption. I wasn't raised with a fundamentalist upbringing either but I heard those stories all my life.

As for the "copy & paste," is it considered that when it was written by me on another forum and copied to this one? If so...then I'm guilty.



.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
04-04-2011, 04:19 PM
Post: #4
RE: The Beginning...as written (second try)
(04-04-2011 02:23 PM)whirlwind Wrote:  
(04-04-2011 02:04 PM)Visqueen Wrote:  
(04-04-2011 11:15 AM)whirlwind Wrote:  Most of us have been taught since childhood that the earth is six thousand years old, that Eve took a bite of an apple, that all men are from Adam and that Noah and his family were the only ones on the ark.

Well actually Whirl, I don't believe that you are correct here. I don't think given the current makeup of the board that a majority of posters would lay claim to a fundamentalist Christian upbringing immersed in literal belief of every word in the bible. I could be wrong, but I think a poll would show otherwise.

You have made a massive assumption.


Plus that's quite a bit of copy paste, don't you think?



LOL....that's it? All that to read and that was the comment?

Okay, let's take the assumption. I wasn't raised with a fundamentalist upbringing either but I heard those stories all my life.

As for the "copy & paste," is it considered that when it was written by me on another forum and copied to this one? If so...then I'm guilty.



.

LOL ! hey? - um yes that's all I have to say. I honestly don't think you want comments or dissenting views, you are looking only to air your beliefs which I guess is fine.

When I found your first line to be that inaccurate I started scrolling to get to the bottom not paying close attention to the rest of it. And you know it took alot of scrolling to get to the end.

Perhaps it's just me and I'm prepared to accept it is, but when I see a post that is this long filled with italics, bolds and different colours I tend to tune out immediately. It has been my experience that it is generally someone trying to sermonize and lo! it is.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
04-30-2011, 11:45 AM
Post: #5
RE: The Beginning...as written (second try)
Bump....for Kevlar
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
04-30-2011, 11:52 AM
Post: #6
RE: The Beginning...as written (second try)
windy Wrote:Most of us have been taught since childhood that the earth is six thousand years old, that Eve took a bite of an apple, that all men are from Adam and that Noah and his family were the only ones on the ark. NONE OF THAT IS TRUE! Concerning the beginning our Father tells us....
Not me windy, I was brought up in the true religion, Catholic........................sorry, it was funny at the time.
I'll get back to this thread, after bed. But if you want to change the meaning of words written in your bible, give it up, it doesn't work.

????????????????
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
04-30-2011, 04:10 PM
Post: #7
RE: The Beginning...as written (second try)
(04-30-2011 11:52 AM)kevlar Wrote:  
windy Wrote:Most of us have been taught since childhood that the earth is six thousand years old, that Eve took a bite of an apple, that all men are from Adam and that Noah and his family were the only ones on the ark. NONE OF THAT IS TRUE! Concerning the beginning our Father tells us....
Not me windy, I was brought up in the true religion, Catholic........................sorry, it was funny at the time.
I'll get back to this thread, after bed. But if you want to change the meaning of words written in your bible, give it up, it doesn't work.

They've been doing it for hundreds of years, Kev.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
05-01-2011, 08:40 AM
Post: #8
RE: The Beginning...as written (second try)
windy Wrote:As you see
not from anything you've written so far windy, assumption #1 fail
windy Wrote:We see that there was a previous age and God's anger destroyed it. Then "there was no man" and "no birds." This is not the flood of Noah being discussed. And, in that previous age....there were CITIES! This was the "casting down and overthrow," the "foundation" that has been kept secret. But, now we know.

What caused God's great anger? Why did He destroy His creation?
You need an incredibly vivid imagination to come to the conclusion of a previous age from your quotes, windy. We've found many of the dinosaurs destroyed at the end of this mythical age, but nary a human or even a brick from the cities. But the real clincher is the word that means "foundation" and "ruin" at the same time. WOW
windy Wrote:Satan...the dragon, the serpent is...the king of Tyrus the fake rock.
I didn't see the proof you provided for this statement windy
windy Wrote:God loved Satan and set him above all others until...iniquity was found in him. What did he do?
It was a huge shock to an omniscient god when satan pulled his trick, just snuck up on him, totally surprised him
I am absolutely convinced windy that you believe everything you have made up there in the OP, unfortunately not a single one of your quotes validates the story you have created. In the beginning you bring in satan, where from, it's the beginning, no mention of him. But you've got him front and centre in your fevered imagination. I'm really sorry windy, but epic fail. Thanks for bumping it for me though.

????????????????
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
05-01-2011, 07:22 PM
Post: #9
RE: The Beginning...as written (second try)
This did not answer my question on the other thread either.

If everyone was thinking the same thing, then no one would be thinking at all.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
05-02-2011, 06:19 AM
Post: #10
RE: The Beginning...as written (second try)
(05-01-2011 07:22 PM)EqualAtheist Wrote:  This did not answer my question on the other thread either.



What exactly is your question?


.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 


Possibly Related Threads...
Thread: Author Replies: Views: Last Post
  God is scientifically redefinable (written by an atheist) %mindless_detector% 262 8,373 09-21-2017 07:52 PM
Last Post: speedyj199
  The beginning of time Odin 190 7,982 03-08-2014 12:54 PM
Last Post: Satyros
  The Beginning....as Written whirlwind 0 537 04-04-2011 10:57 AM
Last Post: whirlwind



User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)