Post Reply 
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
WAR!!
12-12-2008, 01:02 AM
Post: #1
WAR!!
In the bible it is a sin to commit murder. YET!!! there has been more people killed in the name of GOD. By this i mean one religion kills people of another religion just to say that there god is the real god. Now how do you think GOD feels about this yet murder is not allowed according to the bible.

Help Please!!
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
12-12-2008, 03:59 AM
Post: #2
RE: WAR!!
it is a command.to kill is wrong yes.

Good evil salvation
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
01-31-2009, 09:07 AM
Post: #3
RE: WAR!!
(12-12-2008 03:59 AM)smellycat Wrote:  it is a command.to kill is wrong yes.
I think God is appauled & grieved greatly by this Frostbite. War however, is not, technically speaking, murder although I think God grieves no less because of it. The fall of man brought war and murder into our hearts because of our rebellion and what is within the heart is always exhibited in action. Ideologies clash because of this regardless of whether or not they are religious. James points to the ego/self as the root of all conflict and he starts in the Church! How much more then outside of the Church. Whilst the Church is not perfect I don't think that this should be used as an excuse to throw out a spiritual option in one's life. It's the equivalent of throwing the baby out with the bath water. Christ's essential message is one of personal relationship with God and love exhibited toward our fellow man. That some have used the name of Christ to commit atrocities and abominations does not mean that they are disciples of Jesus or can be truly identified as Christians. You might try an examination of the fruits of the Holy Spirit. The reference escapes me at the moment but Christians are identified by the exhibition of the fruits in action.

God bless

Pilgrim Smile

"Love is not a feeling, it's an act of your will." Don Francisco.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
01-31-2009, 10:48 AM
Post: #4
RE: WAR!!
(12-12-2008 01:02 AM)FrostBite Wrote:  In the bible it is a sin to commit murder. YET!!! there has been more people killed in the name of GOD. By this i mean one religion kills people of another religion just to say that there god is the real god. Now how do you think GOD feels about this yet murder is not allowed according to the bible.

Help Please!!
surely he approves or he would have stopped it by now ; )
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
01-31-2009, 11:23 AM (This post was last modified: 01-31-2009 11:30 AM by Pilgrim.)
Post: #5
RE: WAR!!
(01-31-2009 10:48 AM)B MAN Wrote:  
(12-12-2008 01:02 AM)FrostBite Wrote:  In the bible it is a sin to commit murder. YET!!! there has been more people killed in the name of GOD. By this i mean one religion kills people of another religion just to say that there god is the real god. Now how do you think GOD feels about this yet murder is not allowed according to the bible.

Help Please!!
surely he approves or he would have stopped it by now Wink
Well, that's certainly an opinion B MAN although I don't see it as logically justified. God is patient, loving and righteous desiring that no-man perish but should repent and receive salvation. For this reason He does not judge the world even though the horrors we perpetrate cause Him pain. He is longsuffering but will one day, perhaps even very soon intervene because He will be forced to. On that day judgement will be executed and as I believe I've said to you before, that is an option of last resort for God and not something He does willingly. *Bops ya wif me rubber chicken coz yer obviously in a particularly obtuse frame of mind today.* Tongue

"Love is not a feeling, it's an act of your will." Don Francisco.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
01-31-2009, 10:24 PM (This post was last modified: 01-31-2009 10:26 PM by Urthred.)
Post: #6
RE: WAR!!
(01-31-2009 09:07 AM)Pilgrim Wrote:  
(12-12-2008 03:59 AM)smellycat Wrote:  it is a command.to kill is wrong yes.
I think God is appauled & grieved greatly by this Frostbite. War however, is not, technically speaking, murder although I think God grieves no less because of it. The fall of man brought war and murder into our hearts because of our rebellion and what is within the heart is always exhibited in action. Ideologies clash because of this regardless of whether or not they are religious. James points to the ego/self as the root of all conflict and he starts in the Church! How much more then outside of the Church. Whilst the Church is not perfect I don't think that this should be used as an excuse to throw out a spiritual option in one's life. It's the equivalent of throwing the baby out with the bath water. Christ's essential message is one of personal relationship with God and love exhibited toward our fellow man. That some have used the name of Christ to commit atrocities and abominations does not mean that they are disciples of Jesus or can be truly identified as Christians. You might try an examination of the fruits of the Holy Spirit. The reference escapes me at the moment but Christians are identified by the exhibition of the fruits in action.

God bless

Pilgrim Smile

war is not murder? excuse me but how is the man any less dead then if he was a soldier or a priest. does not mean they were disiples of jesus ummm lets she how about Pope Urban who started the first crusade and said "Christ himself will be your leader ... Wear his cross as your badge. If you are killed your sins will be pardoned ... Let those who have been fighting against their own brothers and kinsfolk now fight lawfully against the barbarians." i mean honestly if the pope cant be consider a representivie of christianity and the church who can.

"Perhaps you've seen them only then you've just believed
And when they're fleeing then you feel you've been deceived
But in that feeling something ancient's been retrieved"
-Jack Hardy
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
01-31-2009, 10:56 PM
Post: #7
RE: WAR!!
(01-31-2009 10:24 PM)Urthred Wrote:  war is not murder? excuse me but how is the man any less dead then if he was a soldier or a priest. does not mean they were disiples of jesus ummm lets she how about Pope Urban who started the first crusade and said "Christ himself will be your leader ... Wear his cross as your badge. If you are killed your sins will be pardoned ... Let those who have been fighting against their own brothers and kinsfolk now fight lawfully against the barbarians." i mean honestly if the pope cant be consider a representivie of christianity and the church who can.

Representative? Yes. Perfect? No. Just because the pope does something doesn't mean that its always going to be what God would want him to do.

And its worth noting that willful murder is a sin, but death in general is an innate part of the human condition and how we relate to it is much more complicated than just looking at the Ten Commandments and saying "See! Killing is wrong!"

In response to the OP: Anyone could murder babies in the name of Barney, yet it would be highly illogical to assume that Barney condones or promotes the killing of babies. I would assume that Barney would be very sad at the death of the babies - doubly so if the killing of the babies was done in Barney's own name.

If you should see evident sins or defects, draw out of those thorns the rose; perceiving, moreover, that such apparent sinners may frequently have a good intention, for no one can judge the secrets of the heart of man.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
02-01-2009, 12:45 AM (This post was last modified: 02-01-2009 12:46 AM by Urthred.)
Post: #8
RE: WAR!!
true. but what part of shooting someone in the face is unwillful be it in time of war or peace.

also Barney dosent claim to be incontrol of human actions or have a divine plan (at least that i know).

"Perhaps you've seen them only then you've just believed
And when they're fleeing then you feel you've been deceived
But in that feeling something ancient's been retrieved"
-Jack Hardy
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
02-01-2009, 01:38 AM
Post: #9
RE: WAR!!
(02-01-2009 12:45 AM)Urthred Wrote:  true. but what part of shooting someone in the face is unwillful be it in time of war or peace.

Nothing, and I don't maintain such. It was a seperate point.

Quote:also Barney dosent claim to be incontrol of human actions or have a divine plan (at least that i know).

God is not "in control" of human actions. In fact, one of the basic tenants of most Christian doctrines is free will. A plan? Yes, I'll acknowledge that, but we human beings aren't the most reliable of creatures, and we have a pesky tendency to deviate from God's plan.

In any case, the Barney scenario is a counterargument - Barney does not need to possess the same qualities as God for the point to remain.

If you should see evident sins or defects, draw out of those thorns the rose; perceiving, moreover, that such apparent sinners may frequently have a good intention, for no one can judge the secrets of the heart of man.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
02-01-2009, 09:56 AM
Post: #10
RE: WAR!!
listen, war is not murder. i mean real war, not hiding among the civilian population like terrorists.

when 2 powerful world leaders are at odds with each other, someone is going to die. when you get shipped off into battle here is the only thing that matters
A) either i die or they die. in this case, you kill.
B) either their civilians die as a result of collateral damage, or americans die as a result of collateral damage. once again, you kill.

you do not know the person, do not gain any personal pleasure [minus the safety of one less hostile around], and have no motivation to kill [except that they want to kill you and you believe in your country's ideals].

to call what our military is doing in iraq murder would be simply unpatriotic.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 


Possibly Related Threads...
Thread: Author Replies: Views: Last Post
  Pacifism, Do you think War is ok? Or Do you think War is Wrong? Azrael17 20 2,550 02-14-2010 11:00 PM
Last Post: biomystic



User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)